Vote YES on T-SPLOST vote July 31
Tuesday, June 19, 2012 - 4:49pm
Submitted by Letters to the ...
Submitted by Letters to the ...
Top five reasons to support the transportation referendum:
As most Citizen readers are probably aware, Georgia voters will have the opportunity on July 31 to vote on a one-cent regional T-SPLOST for a 10-year period to fund transportation projects in their region of the state.
For the purpose of the vote, the Georgia legislature divided the state into 12 regions and Fayette County falls in the 10-county Metro Atlanta region where 157 regional projects will be on the list for voters to approve.
These 157 projects are funded with 85 percent of the T-SPLOST with the remaining 15 percent going back to the cities and counties, per a formula based on population and center-lane miles of roadway, to do transportation projects of their choosing.
Like most of you, I see a lot of waste in government and I’m not anxious to have my taxes raised, but here are five reasons why I believe voting YES for transportation is the right thing to do.
1. Metro Atlanta has a traffic crisis.
Depending on which study you read, Atlanta traffic is anywhere from 9th to 15th worst in the nation. We have seven of the 50 worst freeway bottlenecks in the country and that doesn’t even include I-285 at Ga. 400 because 400 is not a freeway. Our average commute times are over 60 minutes which is also one of the worst in the country.
Many may wonder what Atlanta traffic has to do with Fayette County. The answer is that, according to Census Bureau data, 73.8 percent of Fayette County workers leave the county to work and about three-fourths of them work in the five core urban counties of Metro Atlanta. That’s over 50,000 trips by Fayette County residents to and from Atlanta each day. Add to that all of the trips we make to Atlanta for ball games, concerts, shopping and dining and we see that Fayette County is very much impacted by traffic congestion in Atlanta.
2. Fayette County gets a significant return on its tax contribution.
Fayette County is projected to contribute $190.2 million over the 10 years of the tax. In return, we will receive $129.9 million for 10 projects in our county from the list of 157 regional projects, plus $43.6 million of the 15 percent mentioned above for local discretion, for a combined total of $173.5 million.
Not included in that number but of significant benefit to Fayette County is another $22.5 million to reconstruct the I-85/Ga. Highway 74 interchange, $40.2 million to widen Ga. Highway 54 in Fayette and Clayton County, and significant improvements on almost all of the major I-285 interchanges. You can see a list of all the projects at http://transformmetroatlanta.com/regional-projects/.
3. Economic development and jobs.
An economic cost/benefit study of the impact of the referendum indicates that there will be more than a 4 to 1 return on our investment. By spending about $8 billion, the region receives more than $34 billion back in Gross Regional Product by 2040.
If the referendum passes, transportation investments in the metro Atlanta region over the next 10 years will be almost double the investments made in metro Atlanta for the 1996 Olympics.
Econometric modeling shows that tens of thousands of additional jobs will be created and supported and two-thirds of those will be in mid to high-paying sectors.
Finally, because of the congestion relief the transportation investments will bring, the region will save $18 billion from reduced fuel costs and time.
4. Businesses throughout metro Atlanta are supporting the referendum.
Over 200 businesses have already contributed nearly $8 million to help educate and advertise for this referendum. These include some of the biggest economic engines in our state like Cox Enterprises, Georgia Power and Coca-Cola who have each donated at least $250,000; AT&T, Delta Airlines, Home Depot, Newell Rubbermaid and UPS who have each donated at least $100,000.
Some opponents of the referendum have said that raising taxes will drive business out of the state but clearly the business community is clamoring for the state to solve some of our pressing transportation issues and believes the regional TSPLOST should be supported.
5. Existing transportation funding is not meeting our transportation needs.
The overwhelming majority of transportation funding comes from the Highway Trust Fund (HTF), which is funded primarily by the federal portion of fuel taxes, and the Ga. State Motor Fuel Tax. The problem is that neither is able to keep up with our transportation maintenance and new capacity needs.
This is primarily because fuel economy of cars and trucks has improved dramatically over the last few decades while the fuel tax rate has risen little to none. On the federal side, the gas tax is 18.4 cents per gallon (24.4 cents per gallon for diesel) and hasn’t been increased since 1993. On the state side, the motor fuel excise tax of 7.5 cents per gallon hasn’t increased since 1971.
In contrast, fuel efficiency for the average passenger car has increased 40 percent since 1980. That has created a steadily declining revenue source for transportation infrastructure needs at both the state and federal levels while at the same time maintenance and capacity costs have increased.
After years of debate on multiple options, the Georgia legislature has decided that the best way to bridge this widening gap is with a one cent sales tax to be used for transportation.
A metro Atlanta regional roundtable consisting of the county commission chairman and one mayor from each county, plus the mayor of Atlanta, spent almost a year paring down approximately $24 billion in transportation projects to less than $8 billion in projects that they felt were the most important to be funded with the transportation tax. By law, the tax will last for 10 years or until the projected revenue is received, whichever comes FIRST.
So, while none of us want to have our taxes raised, this appears to be a good vehicle to pay for much needed transportation projects that the declining fuel tax won’t be able to fund anytime soon.
It is a pay-as-you-go tax with a defined sunset so we won’t be borrowing money and passing the debt to our kids. The tax is raised here and the tax revenues stay here. We know exactly what regional projects the tax will build.
We get back what we pay in taxes either here in Fayette County or when we travel to our jobs outside Fayette. All the projects in Fayette County are for highways and neighborhood transportation improvements. The voters, and not some faceless bureaucrat or politician in Atlanta or Washington, D.C., decide whether or not we should be taxed.
All in all, I feel like it s a good approach and I urge Fayette County citizens to vote for the TSPLOST on July 31.
Gene Drake
Fayetteville, Ga.
Tue, 06/26/2012 - 2:21pm
#2
That's a Cute Photo
Bob doesn't present any data to support his assertion that only two cars will be removed from the road by all the transit spending but he does have a cute photo and that's probably enough for folks like you who have already made up their minds.
As for me, I'm going to go with the list of 157 projects that was developed through an exhaustive year long process that included transportation experts, elected leaders from all levels of government and significant public input and you and Bob can solve our region's traffic problems with driverless cars, adaptive cruise control and Hispanic bus service. Good luck to you!!
Mon, 06/25/2012 - 9:15pm
#3
Mr. Drake - Your pitch.....
Mr. Drake, notwithstanding that you are pitching hard, few people are buying the fact that the government will be able to solve our "traffic crisis". You see government happens to be the entity that got us into the "crisis" in the first place.
So why would we want to continue to give matches to an arsonist?
Vote, you darn right I am voting against this along with a whole lot of other people, and not just here in Fayette county.
If I were you, I would start looking for other ways to sell concrete pal because this one isn't going to fly.
Mon, 06/25/2012 - 5:41pm
#4
The TIA (TSPLOST) does not relieve traffic congestion
Here is the scary part:
1. When asked how a commuter's commute time would be affected after $8 billion had been spent on the TSPLOST, the ARC's Mike Alexander said it would not change much.
2. When asked how the region would pay for the huge operating and maintenance costs of the mass transit, especially since we are billions behind now, in future years, the ARC's Cain Williamson told the Fayette Board of Commissioners that he did not know how we would do it.
3. ARC’s Jane Hayse said, “The MARTA penny [sales tax collected in DeKalb and Fulton counties] doesn’t cover everything now. There have to be other sources of funding to pay for operations and maintenance.
You, Fayette County citizens, will be one of the "other sources of funding."
Wake up! We know the lobbyist like Gene support the TSPLOST, but they receive the tax, not pay it like we do.
Mon, 06/25/2012 - 8:50pm
#5
Typical Steve
In a pattern that has become typical for this debate, I present facts and studies that can be verified and confirmed and Steve presents quotes that may or may not have been said and almost certainly can't be corroborated (I guess he expects us to just believe him), and if they were, have probably been taken out of context. He further tries to diminish my opinion by calling me a lobbyist in hopes that it will deflect the reader's attention. Unfortunately for him, I presented an editorial of facts, not opinions, so my position as the Executive Director of the Georgia Concrete Paving Association doesn't diminish the truth (not that Steve is even vaguely familiar with the truth).
By the way Steve, as a Fayette County resident, I most certainly will pay the tax but nice try at distortion again.
Mon, 06/25/2012 - 11:41pm
#6
You were at those meetings, Gene
You were present in Cherokee County for Mike Alexander's comment and in Fayette County for Cain Williamson's comment.
It's pretty clear why the Georgia Concrete Paving Association wants the TIA (TSPLOST) to PA$$.
If we cannot pay the operations and maintenance costs of the current transit system then how will we cover the exorbitant costs of a significantly expanded version? Where do the billions of dollars come from?
Gene, if you cannot answer that question, you need to vote "no" because that's negligence.
Mon, 06/25/2012 - 6:45pm
#7
Well Gee Steve
The EFB won't relieve any traffic congestion from Fayetteville, yet you can't wait to build it. You're different from them how?
Mon, 06/25/2012 - 11:38pm
#8
Can wait
Hutch866, I can wait ... just take a look at our budget.
The main point about the EFB is it had priority over the WFB (a much lesser project) and yet the WFB got all the funds.
Tue, 06/26/2012 - 12:06am
#9
Steve Brown
Seems you still dodge the fact that the EFB will divert even less traffic then the WFB, but you still want to build it. Why do you always deal in half truths and innuendo?
Tell me Steve, you have a rebuttal to this...
http://www.politifact.com/georgia/statements/2012/jun/12/steve-brown/tra...
Another half truth?
Fri, 06/29/2012 - 8:42pm
#10
Steve Brown
Still no answer Steve? Wow, I'm surprised, well maybe not.
http://www.politifact.com/georgia/statements/2012/jun/12/steve-brown/tra...
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 8:34am
#11
Just raise the gas tax
IF we truly need the money.
I would be in favor of that, it would be used for roads and not to prop up Marta in only two Counties. Everyone traveling through our fair state would pay.
With cars getting more and more economical, I don't see why this isn't addressed. How long has it been at the current rate per gallon? I realize Georgia uses a percentage, but the point stands.
Me thinks the politicians are scared to address real issues.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 2:17pm
#12
Visitors Pay
Spyglass - You are right that if we raised the gas tax, visitors to our state would help pay the tax but that is also true with the sales tax.
According to the Atlanta Convention and Visitors Bureau, in 2010 metro Atlanta had $10.9 billion spent for tourism. That would equate to $109 million per year in sales tax receipts, or $1.1 billion over the next 10 years. That’s 15% of the $7.2 billion in today’s dollars.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 2:30pm
#13
Did you not understand?
I am not in favor of propping up a failed Marta.
That is an automatic tsplost fail to me.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 2:46pm
#14
We Aren't Propping Up MARTA
We pay in $190.2 million and get back $173.5 million directly to Fayette plus we are the primary users of the $22.5 million 74/85 interchange in Fulton, big users of the $40.2 million GA54 widening, which is credited to Clayton but is in Fayette as well, and get significant benefit from all of the I-285 interchanges that are being improved. As a percentage of what we pay in, we get the second largest ROI of the 10 counties.
Please explain to me how there is money left over from Fayette County to prop up MARTA. Fulton and DeKalb wanted a majority of their project money to go to transit and it it is but our money is going for roads and bridges that are important to us.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 3:19pm
#15
So no money to Marta?
Is that your claim?
The entire state need road improvements, hence my thoughts on the state gas tax. It is roads only, or supposed to be.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 11:55am
#16
Raise the gas tax?
Just raise the gas tax
On the Federal level at least, only about 60% of the gas tax actually goes for roads and bridges.
Then-Secretary of Transportation Mary Peters stated on August 15, 2007 that about 60% of federal gas taxes are used for highway and bridge construction. The remaining 40% goes to earmarked programs.[3] However, revenues from other taxes are also used in federal transportation programs.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_taxes_in_the_United_States
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 2:27pm
#17
State of Georgia
Is what I am talking about
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 6:57am
#18
G35 Dude
You say that the West Bypass is worthwhile. Why don't you be the first citizen to give us your reasons why? You might start by explaining how a road to nowhere 3 miles West of Fayetteville will reduce traffic in Fayetteville.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 8:05am
#19
where did G35 say the WFB was "worthwhile?"
I've never seen that here if he indeed said anything remotely like that. What I see is him questioning why either bypass was ever necessary.
Maybe instead of looking under rocks for enemies like a Steve Brown or Haddix or some of the other clowns in FC do 24/7, notice those who already agree with your anti-WFB cause. Well, except he might not support the EFB either, something you surely do.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 8:16am
#20
Nuk & G35
He didn't say hat--it was Mr. Drake.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 8:45am
#21
G35
I must be missing something.....I see pips stating that G35 thinks the WFB is worthwhile on my screen :)
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 10:49am
#22
PIP, NUK and others
I must be missing something.....I see pips stating that G35 thinks the WFB is worthwhile on my screen :)
I must be getting old. I don't ever remember saying that. ;-)
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 12:02pm
#23
My apologes, G35 Dude
I read your "quote" too fast without linking it to Mr. Drake. It's interesting that he keeps on ranting, even though nobody seems to agree with him.
As a paid concrete lobbyist, you have to give him credit for tenacity and perseverance. But maybe that's good, as it draws everybody's attention to the fact that the TSPLOST is just about as popular in Fayette County as the West Bypass. The 2009 SPLOST failed here by a 24/76 margin.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 2:36pm
#24
No problem PIPS
I've made the same mistake in the past. I too agree that Mr Drakes postings are a good thing. First he is entitled to his opinion just like the rest of us. And second I have to admit that I would not have done as much research on the T-SPLOST as I did had he not been here to stoke the fire so to speak.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 3:40pm
#25
Agree on Mr. Drake
I'm glad he's here and participating whether I agree with him or not. He made me dig deeper into why I am opposed to the TSPLOST then and now because he makes a decent argument, especially when it comes to Steve Brown :)
Still, TSPLOST isn't a good solution IMO, regardless of "perfect" or not. I still see it as a cop-out from the State/Repub Party/Gov on down and abdicating their responsibilities to govern because they were too chicken **** to do it the right way.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 4:08pm
#26
You've Probably Seen This Before
I know I've put this out before but I'll share it one more time. Two years ago, when the legislature was debating this issue, I asked a member of the Senate Transportation Committee why they didn't just raise the gas tax instead of a TSPLOST. He said that it would have to be raised 25 cents to be worthwhile to which I reponded, raise it 2 cents a month for the next 12 months and you'll be there a year before the TSPLOST even goes to the voters and nobody will even notice. He said he thought that was a great idea but, unfortunately, he was running for re-election and there were 50 other guys running for re-election and they weren't going to raise taxes. When I relayed the story to our lobbyist (that's right, despite what pips thinks, I'm not a lobbyist), he told me the legislature was deathly afraid of the Tea Party and they weren't willing to make them mad by raising taxes directly so they were going to let the voters decide for themselves.
So, while you are right that they don't have the will to address our transportation problems directly, they gave us a pretty good vehicle to do it ourselves. Do you really think that if this doesn't pass, they will all of the sudden have the intestinal fortitude to take on the Tea Party (who they call CAVE people, Citizens Against Virtually Everything)? Of course not. That's why I say that while it is flawed it is still pretty good and that's why the business community is supporting it so strongly.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 5:47pm
#27
I appreciate the comments..
re the Gas Tax, etc.
I know we are ran by lemmings at the State govt level...
I fail to see why this is better than a gas tax though...any monies collected and passed on to a money losing Marta system are monies wasted in my opinion.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 10:44am
#28
Don't support political shell games
The first thing everyone should remember is that transportation has been funded by our taxes forever. Transportation funding has been declining because our politicians have been sending our money to other projects. So, these politicians came up with a way to fool the sheeple of GA into thinking that they could gain some control over their transportation needs IF they will just tax themselves a bit more. There was no tax refund of the taxes already being paid that should go to transportation.
So first thing to remember is this is a scam!
From here it is easy to progress to the subsidiary antics that proceed from a scam. Our representative, Don Haddix, was removed illegally and without representative support for instance. I won't go over the list again that has been well reasoned and presented but there is NO reason to expect anything good from this TSPLOST.
VOTE NO on TSPLOST
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 4:36pm
#29
citizenal & "other projects"
Maybe like the $20 million plus they found for the idiotic "Go Fish" pet project of then-Gov Perdue? Wonder how many miles of asphalt 20m would buy?
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 9:59am
#30
Vote NO on TSPLOST
Isn't Gene Drake in the concrete paving business, and does he not stand to gain directly if the tax is passed? If so, it is sleazy to write letters like this without disclosure.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 6:24pm
#31
Citizen Steve - Drake
The answers are yes and yes.
He's also not propping up MARTA, he's propping up ANYTHING that uses concrete.
But! He's no lobbyist. LOL
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 10:26am
#32
I Am
As most readers of this blog know, I am the Executive Director of the Georgia Concrete Paving Association. Had this been an opinion piece instead of a statement of facts, perhaps that would have been necessary to note. As it stands, I recommend you debate the merits of the referendum as opposed to trying to deflect the reader's attention.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 2:18pm
#33
Geeeeeezz...MARTA again
While I am opposed to the T-SPLOST myself, the candidates running for FC Commish and Steve Brown, who always 100% in campaign mode and nothing else matters, just can't resist bringing good 'ol MARTA into this. MARTA isn't the issue here.
I don't give a damn about MARTA and the idea that it's going to invade FC any day makes me question just how stupid people are in FC who believe this. People that think the birthers are lunatics need to really study the 50% or so of the population in FC who thinks MARTA is coming to FC! Jack smith! Herb Frady! Ken Steele! OMG! MARTA's coming!
When you have no ideas of your own and your only method of gaining popular support is appealing to the lowest common denominator by attacking non-existent boogeymen like MARTA and ridiculous sloganeering all the time....well, I guess that makes for a successful FC politician these days!
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 10:45am
#34
Objectivity?
So you claim complete objectivity?
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 1:31pm
#35
Statement of fact
The representative of the concrete pavers wants us to pass a bill that provides huge spending for concrete paving.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 1:37pm
#36
Once Again...
...you are unable or unwilling to debate the merits of the referendum so you try to deflect people's attention from the real issues. Perhaps you're Citizen_Steve Brown...judging by your tactics.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 9:42am
#37
Oops - A typo
I'm sure. The continuation of the Yes on Tsplost continues on A5 in The Citizen - not A7. Thanks to The Citizen for giving the two opinions on the yes or no vote. Thank you Gene Drake.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 9:30am
#38
Gene- you have no clue what the problem really is do you
This is the first splost of any type in the history of the state that the specific projects the money will be used for are not listed or even decided yet. That should be a red flag right there.
The state DOT is one of the worst managed (financially)organizations in the state. Theyve had 4 directors in 6 years. And now you want to almost triple their budget from 400-500 million/yr to 1.3 billion/yr overnight? What reasonable expectations do the citizens have that that money will be looked out for responsibly? ill tell you. none at all.
How many people get up in the morning and think, "y'know, if only the govt would tax us more, all our problems would be solved." same answer as before, none at all. Why would you think that adding a consumption tax on top of our 6% state income tax is a good idea? Why can florida and tennessee manage their problems without income taxes and not us? Gene, drop the income tax and maybe the rest of us will listen to you.
The problem isint roads, its jobs. namely we havent had a buisiness friendly climate in this state to create them. if there were lots of good quality high paying jobs in the area, people would come here no matter how long the commute was. if there are no jobs, people are going to leave, regardless of how great the roads are.
You quoted a lot of stats, so let me give you some. Ga has gone from 20th to 41st in the nation for average income. weve alsogone from 4% of jobs being minimum wage to 10%. are you going to tell me that clogged intersections made that happen? or that it will fix it?
We need a different tax system in the state to make it a more buisiness friendly environment. Stop taxing small buisiness and self employed at the personal income rate. That will do a lot more for the state and its cofferes than more taxes for phantom road projects ever will.
You point out that cars have gotten more efficient over the years, as if were supposed to feel guilty about not giving as much tax money to the state and now we should make up for our miserly ways by paying some other tax. How rediculous. Plus, you example fails, since you neglected to account for the fact that there are som many more cars on the road now. Fuel tax revenues are up since 1980, not down.
Its too bad you arent bemoaning the fact that the state Gov't isint 40% more efficent, instead of complaining we dont pay enough in taxes already.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 10:14am
#39
Clues
This is the first splost of any type in the history of the state that the specific projects the money will be used for are not listed or even decided yet. That should be a red flag right there.
Perhaps you didn't click on the link in the article where you can find all 157 projects on the list including a detailed description, their cost and when they are planned to be constructed.
The state DOT is one of the worst managed (financially)organizations in the state.
Here is a link to a National Cooperative Highway Research Program study that shows GDOT is number one in the nation at delivering projects within budget and number two in the nation at delivering them on time, http://onlinepubs.trb.org/onlinepubs/nchrp/docs/NCHRP20-24(37)A(01)_FR.pdf. I hardly think that qualifies as mismanagement.
What reasonable expectations do the citizens have that that money will be looked out for responsibly?
The law calls for a Citizen Review Panel to monitor the projects and insure they are being delivered on time and on budget. That is an unprecedented step towards government accountability.
The bottom line for me is that government has some legitimate functions like the military, police and firefighters, and infrastructure that are worth paying for and taxes are the way we pay for them. A T-SPLOST may not be the perfect vehicle for this but after years of debate, the legislature felt like it was the best vehicle. I, along with much of the business community, am not willing to let perfect be the enemy of good.
Gene Drake
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 6:33pm
#40
efdrakejr-Unaccounted for money?
Perhaps you didn't click on the link in the article where you can find all 157 projects on the list including a detailed description, their cost and when they are planned to be constructed.
I just read that over $1 billion of these funds will be returned to different areas to be used as they please? Based on that the list you refer to is not a complete list? Considering Fayette County's recent history I have concerns about this. Can we say Fayette bypass? And I still don't see how a bill that will use over 50% for mass transit and have over $1 billion unaccounted for can be good for Fayette. And guess which county gets the lowest cut of this money? Yep Fayette. I just don't see how we'll get a fair return on our money.
http://www.ajc.com/news/transportation-referendum/public-in-the-dark-145...
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 8:58pm
#41
English and Math
If that is what renault314 was talking about then she is correct. The municipalities, who will receive the 15% portion of the tax, are not required by the bill to generate their lists of projects before the vote. Some have and some, including Fayette, have not. Unfortunately, particularly for a school teacher, she has an alarming inability to articulate her position, much less spell and construct a sentence correctly, so that was not what she said. But I digress.
I can say Fayette Bypass. In fact, I can say West Fayette Bypass and East Fayette Bypass and I think both projects are worthwhile. Despite what the vocal minority has been able to lead you to believe, the WFB has been on the county transportation plan for a long time. It was just moved ahead of the EFB, it was not concoted as some nefarious Developer's Highway. In fact, from where I live off of Redwine Road, I think it will be a significant time saver for hundreds of households. Don't drink their Kool-Aid...it will eventually make you sick.
As for the payback, I just don't know how else to do the math for you. We pay in $190.2 million and get back $173.5 million directly to Fayette plus we are the primary users of the $22.5 million 74/85 interchange in Fulton, big users of the $40.2 million GA54 widening, which is credited to Clayton, and get significant benefit from all of the I-285 interchanges that are being improved. As a percentage of what we pay in, we get the second largest ROI of the 10 counties.
It's not perfect G-Dude, but it's good.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 4:10pm
#42
efdrakejr - English and math
For someone who constantly asks others to debate them on the merits of their arguments and not "distract" them with irrelevancies, you sure are quick to rip on me for spelling and grammar. tell me, does misspelling a word completely invalidate the point I was making? If it does, everyone on here is wasting their time as well. This is a very "pot calling the kettle black" moment.
It just so happens that I WAS talking about the projects that fayette will use their 15% on. No requirement to list them, which as Obama likes to say, is unprecedented.
Something else you may not be aware of. As a teacher I have seen over and over again state budget balancing that requires austerity cuts from education. Then, a few years later when revenues go back up, the legislature says "Hey! Where did all this money come from?! Lets spend it on our pet projects!" Always somehow forgetting that the "extra money" was what they took FROM education but forget to put back. Then a few years later, it happens again and again and again. I only mention this because the same thing happens to the DOT. If they ( the state reps) would just stop diverting the money that used to go to the DOT instead of "finding" the money after austerity cuts and spending it on other things, we would have enought to pay for these projects without raising taxes.
You had answers to a lot of my other questions, but as the head of a pro buisiness org, Im surprised you had no comment on my opinions about taxes being too high, taxes being misspent and there not being a pro buisiness climate in this state. All things that if fixed, would not only slove our road problem, but would solve most problems in the state. All without raising taxes. Now, if you please, answer those questions without corrcting my grammar?
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 5:11pm
#43
Taxes
Sorry for going on the offensive but when you start your post by saying I don't have a clue, don't be surprised by a strong response. Let's put it behind us.
I don't claim to be an expert on how education funds are collected or distributed but here is how the gas tax works. Georgia has two parts to their gas tax, a 7.5 cent per gallon excise tax which I mentioned in my original letter has not increased since 1971, and a 4% sales tax that is applied to the average price published by the state on Jan 1 and Jul 1 of every year. Additionally, there is a federal tax of 18.4 cents per gallon which has not increased since 1993. For the state portion, GDOT gets the 7.5 cent per gallon excise tax and 3% of the sales tax. The other 1% goes to the general fund. Though GDOT would like to get the entire 4%, it has been done this way for as long as I can remember and is not a case of the legislature raiding GDOT funds in lean times. We truly have a declining income stream for roads and bridges and it's not enough to keep up with maintenance and new capacity demands, even in the good times.
As for the taxes, the legislature made pretty sweeping tax reforms this year in an attempt to make us more business friendly. They didn't get everything through that they wanted to but I expect they will take a few more bites at the apple next year. Those changes are good and more will be great but they are not going to magically dump an extra billion dollars per year in transportation infrastructure funds into the state. It's easy to say that a better tax system would not only solve our road problems but most other problems in the state, and intuitively I see your point, but you're not providing data that shows X reduction in tax rates would generate Y in increased revenue from increased business so it's really just speculation. I support the idea but without hard numbers I'm not willing to abandon the already thoroughly developed TSPLOST.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 1:22pm
#44
Mr. Drake
You are quite old enough to be able to communicate without resorting to belittling and derogatory comments! You seem to have great difficulty with speaking to certain people. Your manner of communicating with some folks reminds me of a former Fayette County commissioner who had the same problem.
Now, since you brought up the subject, I feel compelled to set the record straight with regards to the West Fayetteville Bypass and the East Fayetteville Bypass.
You said, "Despite what the vocal minority has been able to lead you to believe, the WFB has been on the county transportation plan for a long time." The truth is that both projects have been on one or another county transportation plan since 1985.
Then you said, "It was just moved ahead of the EFB, it was not concoted (Did you mean to say concocted?) as some nefarious Developer's Highway." The truth is that, yes indeed, the WFB is a Developer's Highway. I have known many of the old family landowners along the WFB for more years than I would like to think about. Our children were friends as they were growing up. I have known for many, many years that some of those folks want to develop their land and that they have built-in developers within the families.
What I didn't know, however, until former Fayetteville Mayor Ken Steele was forced to announce it, some of those folks have been involved with the Fayette County Development Authority, our commissioners, and the city of Fayetteville's development people in planning a 2,000 acre high density development known as the West Fayetteville Neighborhoods.. Also, during the 2011 Fayetteville Mayoral debate, Ken Steele made the declarative statement that the "West Fayetteville Bypass will not relieve traffic."
In addition to the West Fayetteville Neighborhoods development, there are many hundreds of acres owned by
other well known developers along Phase II of the West Bypass. The largest tracts are owned by another family of developers that have been financial supporters of some past and present commissioners. One of those tracts sits directly behind my house and property.
Mr. Drake, I feel sure you've had all of the above information concerning the WFB for quite some time. However, I would like to request that you stick to what you do best and that is trying to sell your completely biased opinions. PLEASE know that the people of Fayette County are not ignorant. We are capable of thinking, and we are capable of analyzing more data than you could imagine.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 2:05pm
#45
Analyzing Data
Your problem is that, instead of analyzing data and then drawing conclusions, you already have the conclusion firmly set in your mind and then you select data (often quotes that no one can verify) to support your preconceived conclusion. There is no chance in the world that you will ever think that the WFB is being constructed for anything other than greedy personal gain facilitated by dirty politicians in an attempt to enrich themselves. I don't think that's the case and that's why I don't care to engage you further in these conversations.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 4:31pm
#46
Cement mixer, putti, putti-----
Cement mixer, putti, putti. Does anyone else remember that oldie goldie song? For some reason every time I see a post from efdrakejr it comes to mind.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 3:54pm
#47
Mr. Drake, Just Ignore Me, PLEASE!
You have every right to say, "I don't care to engage you further in these conversations." So, please don't respond when I post something!
However, even though you don't wish to converse with me that doesn't negate the fact that I have a right to post my comments, until I fall into disfavor with the powers that be.
I have never referred to any politician as "dirty."
I know better than to quote something that can't be verified.
You, Mr. Drake, are the one referencing preconceived conclusions with your accusatory statements of others.
Once again, if I post something in a response, JUST IGNORE ME. My feelings won't be hurt one little bit.
Tue, 06/26/2012 - 12:52pm
#48
Mr Drake-Fayette Bypasses
I can say Fayette Bypass. In fact, I can say West Fayette Bypass and East Fayette Bypass and I think both projects are worthwhile. Despite what the vocal minority has been able to lead you to believe, the WFB has been on the county transportation plan for a long time.
It is my understanding that there was no study done to verify that these bypasses were worthwhile?
Tue, 06/26/2012 - 2:13pm
#49
Second Post
G-Dude - This seems to be the second time you've posted this so I assume you want an answer from me. The answer is I don't know. I don't work for the county and, to my knowledge, their records for Needs Assessments aren't available online. I simply looked at a map of the route and know that there are subdivisions with hundreds of households close by, many of which are in the income category that suggests the wage earner is employed outside the county and came up with the conclusion I stated:
In fact, from where I live off of Redwine Road, I think it will be a significant time saver for hundreds of households.
It's just intuition on my part and it may have been intuition on the part of the county leaders when they put it on the Transportation Plan back in 1985.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 10:50am
#50
We need cart paths, bike paths, walking paths - and mass transit
Responsible administration to reduce congestion - do as much as possible to build things that don't reduce congestion such as:
cart paths; bike paths, walking paths - and MARTA.
The whole plan is absurd.
Legislation has been presented to allow neighboring counties to join forces to do transportation projects IF their voters approve. This is a much better proposal that holding voters hostage if they disapprove.
Mon, 06/25/2012 - 6:56pm
#51
Cart Paths
I agree instead of the stupid sidewalks that run up and down Hwy 74 South a cart path would have encourage folks to not get in the car and probably be cheaper to build than sidewalks that rarely are used.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 9:11am
#52
Absolutely nothing about this T-SPLOST...
...outside of improving the 1-85/GA 74 intersection appears to be necessary or needed by FayCo residents, IMHO.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 1:39pm
#53
kc andy,
If it did only that it would be well worth the penny, imho. Construction of new business is starting again near that interchange, and Fairburn does not give one damn whether the congestion there screws up commutes for Fayette/Coweta.
That interchange is exhibit A for what happens when you have an every-jurisdiction-for-itself approach to transportation and planning, especially in a state with way too many counties.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 2:27pm
#54
Agreed, bowser...
...that anything relative to the interstate(s) should be state controlled, w/ occassional Federal input/support if needed. And also agree their are WAY too many counties!
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 8:42am
#55
Vote NO on T-Splost
Why would we want something like the taxpayer subsidized Marta to come to Fayetteville? To bring more crime to the area?
They say that it will only be for 10 years, but we all know how that story ends.
Government needs to learn to live within its means.
Vote NO on T-Splost
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 10:59am
#56
No MARTA in Fayette
Once again, please review the list of projects and you will see that there are no projects that include extending MARTA to Fayette County. That is a smokescreen by Steve Brown and other detractors unwilling to debate the true merits of the referendum.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 11:42am
#57
It doesnt matter where the rail is being built
Because 52 cents of every dollar collected throughout the region is going to mass transit. Perhaps people in Fayette would find this tax easier to support if that were not true. Had this been a tax that truly offered solutions to gridlock, many of the key opponents here would have at least considered supporting it. A better solution would have been to collect half as much money and fund the roadway improvements. Right now, people in Fayette are upset because 52 cents of every dollar collected is going to fund mass transit that is not only outside of our county, but will also need to be further subsidized by a ridiculous 2250 dollars a rider. We do not need to be drug into this MARTA morass. The big counties need to solve their own problems, not bleed us to alleviate their pain.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 12:09pm
#58
It Does Matter
It matters because this $2250 subsidy that you like to reference is borne almost entirely by Fulton and DeKalb Counties (which is where MARTA is located) through an additional 1 cent tax that they have been paying for 30 years. Steve Brown, and I guess now you too, like to make everyone believe that Fayette is going to be responsible for MARTA and that's just not true.
If your case is that because there are MARTA projects on the TIA list then Fayette is subsidizing MARTA, then the same case could be made that Fulton is subsidizing Fayette by allowing the GA74/I-85 project to be on their list of projects. As you know, the vast majority of Fulton residents live north of that interchange and they have absolutely no incentive to fix it for our residents other than it was part of the regional cooperation.
I personally agree that there is too much transit. If I was making the list, I would have concentrated more on roads but Fayette put projects on the list that were important to us and Fulton and DeKalb put projects on the list that were important to them. I don't know why you and Steve think you are more qualified to manage their lists than they are.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 1:57pm
#59
Ed
The operational shortage and maintnance shortage that MARTA faces will continue to grow, and now that MARTA has been regionalized, we will get the bill. It's just a matter of time.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 12:33pm
#60
Mr. Drake
Try on this for size. WE DON'T WANT TO BE TAXED ANY HIGHER THAN WE ARE NOW!
Did you hear that, Mr Drake? We are tired of being taxed, expecially for 10 years with no end in sight. We're not stupid - we know how these games work.
When Obama is tossed out of office in November 2012 and the economy begins to recover, perhaps then will be a good time to bring it up.
The T-Splosters picked a very bad time to hit tax paying Americans up for more money for government projects.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 1:41pm
#61
Joe Kawfi
I think you should vote against it. Hopefully, though, there will be enough people who are interested in solving our traffic issues and not just being opposed to everything government does that we can still get it passed.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 8:55pm
#62
Eugene
I really don't care what you think I should do. I never said that I was opposed to everything government does so please do not try to put words in my mouth, Eugene
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 9:06pm
#63
I Guess You're Not Stupid
You said in your previous post that you're not stupid and I guess this proves it. You were able to take the E in my initials plus my signature of Gene and derive that my name is really Eugene and you are correct!! You are one sharp tool.
Thu, 06/21/2012 - 7:58am
#64
Oh, Eugene
Don't get your panties in a wad now. Personal attacks are really unbecoming of you, Eugene. Citizens that have been around the block a few times with these government project know better that to vote a new tax on themselves.
Wed, 06/20/2012 - 1:31am
#65
Fayette does not want anything to do with your TSPLOST
Fayette does not want anything to do with your TSPLOST. Out of the 8 candidates running for county commissioner only 2 support this tax; however they did not actually admit they support this tax, they implied they had not made a decision yet?? Is the Chamber pushing this tax also? What does that tell ya?
Here's an opinion from someone you seem to respect, but he disagrees that the regional TSPLOST will solve more problems than it will create. At least you said that he was a legitimate or qualified debater. Please read Bob Ross' views on the TSPLOST as set forth in the following link, and let us know where you feel that he is in error. His presentation certainly appears to be well thought out and worded.
I'd especially like to see your views on the congestion photo that shows TSPLOST as reducing the traffic volume insignificantly.
The weblink is http://youtu.be/6DoirHD2hu0.